0:10
[clears throat] Um, couple of questions have come up that are not strictly uh on top of where we are, but I am going to pick us back up here in in Titus chapter 1.
0:23
Um, and I want to run through I've got three things I want to try to to hit this morning. So, if I don't call on you when you've raised your hand, it's not personal. There's just I've I've got an outline that's a little more rigid than
0:34
I sometimes do, and I want to try to get through these things so that we're all clear on these points. Um, so I think we're going to go in in order of in uh decreasing tangentiality. So, we're
0:46
going to start at our most tangential, and when we get to the last one, we're going to be right back on the rails, and we'll move on next week, Lord willing. So, um, we've read here in in Titus chapter 1, um, where Paul using this
0:59
language to Titus, um, and I've written it here for you since we're going to do a little bit of a word study this morning, and I will ask for those of you who are better Greek scholars than me to chime in. But, um, in Titus chapter 1,
1:10
he tells Titus to appoint elders in every city. And the question came up because there's a bunch of different words that get thrown around here for the title of elder. Um, and the question
1:22
sort of came up because we we were even talking about the fact that the word in the Greek for elder is not used strictly as an official title in all
1:33
places. So that's what we're going to address first of all is the various words that we read for the office and a little bit in terms of why we're doing this particular word and whether or not it
1:44
matters exactly what we use. We can talk about that. So um I have written here uh Titus chapter 1 verse 5 or part of it where he says appoint elders in every
1:56
town uh or in every city and it's this word here presbuteros from which yes you get the word presbyarian um it is just
2:06
the word in Greek that means older than it is originally in its original context it is a comparative word
2:19
Just like I would say that I have older brothers because I do. It's that word in in the Greek it's older. But just like we use the word elder in English when you say respect your elders it has that
2:31
context. It over the usage of it by the time we get to the the first century here where this is being written it does have a tendency to mean the way we use that in English those that you owe
2:41
respect to because of their maturity and their position in your community. So, it does begin to take that on. You read that in a number of different places. You have uh I think it's three or four
2:52
references in the New Testament to non-Christian elders. In fact, when you look at um some of you may be familiar with the Sanhedrin, um the Sanhedrin
3:04
being effectively the Supreme Court for the Jewish people in the time of Jesus. Um you have a couple of places in Acts where the members of the Sanhedrin are referred to as the elders.
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So it does have that honorific sense to it. However, it also gets used in the Greek here and in Paul's writings in particular, but also where dad is right now in um first Peter. The word elder
3:33
seems to be used in a in an official capacity. And so it's used as a title for I mean here he says appoint elders. So if we were only referring to the
3:44
general sense of those in your community who are mature whom you respect, that's not really something you get appointed to. That's something that your character and your position endows to itself. So
3:55
here we have this word elder in the sense of put them in an office which we typically are using this word in in our polity and in our conversations here in
4:06
this church. We tend to use the word elder. We refer to Mark and Chuck as the elders of Fellowship Bible Church. Um, the other word that comes up here,
4:16
um, and I put it here from first tit from Titus, uh, 1:7 is, uh, okonomoman, which is literally in your translations translated to
4:27
steward. I don't have a problem with the word steward at all. I'm standing in front of my text, aren't I?
4:46
so here where he says it behooves them as God's steward. Okay. And the word right before that which I for some reason did not write down here is overseer. I meant to have that as my second one. Um
4:57
which is in the Greek. So sorry this should actually be C and my B point should have been
5:12
which we translate as overseer in the English. Okay. And we did talk a little bit about this word when we were talking uh contextually about that particular passage. The idea of overseer. Um it is a compound word
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meaning one who um looks or um this is sort of around or over the epi. And then the scopos is the same word where we get
5:33
scope from. It is the the looking the the intent or even targeting sense of that word. But this is also where if you follow linguistic drift uh what I'm
5:44
going to use this color. Why not? This goes into Latin. So you can blame it on the
6:33
Some of your translations may even have the word bishop there depending on if you've got an older translation. That's how we get the word bishop out of Episcopas. Okay? So, it went Latin, it went only English, it went into English, it became bishop in that direction. So,
6:45
if you ever wondered why do we say bishop because you can't find the word bishop in Greek, it's not a Greek word. It comes from that word which is quite literally overseer. It's a compound
6:56
word. Okay. So that is one of the terms you will find used in various places. Um is bishop. That's where that comes from. Um third one there is steward. Um this
7:08
is not unique to this office. This is the same word the same way we use the word steward in English. Um, if you if you care about linguistics in that way, wa noman is very closely
7:21
related to economy. That's where we get that word from. You could even translate this as economist if you were inclined to do that. Okay? The one in charge of the household economy. That's that's
7:31
what that word root is about. So, these are the words that we have here in Titus. Um, I'm going to take us over Yes. Where's the steward?
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Uh that's in verse seven where he says uh yeah so the overseer must be above reproach as God's steward. This is so I
7:54
did these out of order. This is part one and then part two of verse seven.
8:06
Steward is also title ruler of the house. Right. Ruler of the house. And so we did touch on this contextually. Um it's the same idea as um you know Joseph's position in Potterer's house, right? As you take
8:16
your biblical example there, he was in charge of all of the particulars. Um he had charge over everything up to but not including Piper himself basically is
8:27
what we're told there of of um Joseph. And so it is it is used in that same way. A steward, one who is given responsibility for management of these
8:39
things on someone else's behalf. That's the point there. Okay. So that's not one that you find um taken up as church office very much. But again, it's just it's used in the Greek the same way it's
8:50
used in the English. Um I'm going to jump over now to Ephesians chapter 4. And again, if I don't [clears throat] call on you or I don't run down every single part of this
9:02
verse, you'll forgive me. Um, because I'm trying to focus us in on specifically this phrasing here and why we do this um, as we're talking about
9:13
what it is to be an elder because that's where we're starting here in Titus. That's what he's talking about. So, um, in Ephesians chapter 4, um, I'm
9:24
going to pick up in verse 7 and read a couple of verses here just to give us the round here. Ephesians chapter 4, beginning in verse 7, Paul writes, "But to each one of us, grace was given
9:36
according to the measure of Christ's gift." Therefore, it says, "When he ascended on high, he led captive a host of captives, and he gave gifts to men."
9:47
Now this expression, he ascended, what does it mean? Except that he had also descended into the lower parts of the earth. And he who descended is he himself who also ascended far above all
9:58
the heavens so that he might fill all things. And he gave some as apostles, some as prophets, some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for
10:08
the equipping of the saints, for the work of ministry, to the building up of the body in Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature
10:19
man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ. As a result, we are no longer to be children tossed here and there by waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine
10:31
or by trickery of men by craftiness and deceitful scheming, but speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up into all aspects, into him who is the head,
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namely Christ, from whom the whole body, being fitted and held together by what every joint supplies, according to the proper working of each individual part, causes the growth of the body for the
10:52
building up of itself. self in love. Now, this passage and I am going to fall into the classic trope of touching on this passage specifically to talk about the officers,
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the officers, but we're going to talk about other parts of it also as we go, Lord willing. Um, so you get four ph or four words, sorry, four titles, five words,
11:17
and I'll explain what I mean as we go here. So first of all you get it tells us that God gave these gifts to
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the church. He gave these gifts some as apostilos. I bet you can guess what that means.
12:18
I recognize that I've been here a long time and uh in touching on these things uh previously, I sort of glanced over them assuming that everyone was familiar, which was my mistake. Not everyone's familiar with these. Not
12:29
everybody's heard adnauseium from seminarians about the various offices and why we do and don't do these things. So I will, you know, take questions if you have specific questions about this. But here's why that we separate this
12:41
this way. Unless particular do denominations will actually point to this passage and say there are five offices of the church that are these five words and they are five separate offices of the church.
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Most of your English translations, as far as I can tell, have actually been fairly careful with the Greek here. Um, obviously there's no um punctuation in the original, but we have apostles. That
13:04
one's pretty obvious. Prophets is pretty obvious. Evangelistas, obvious. Evangelistas, wish they called themselves that. That'd be funnier. be funnier. Um, these are all fairly self-evident
13:15
because we use an English transliteration of them.
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if you've done a lot of English roots of things or you were ever in spelling B you would have learned the idea of didactic or things like that that's where this comes from it's just dascos or dascalos means teachers
13:55
Okay. So, it's very similar to some of the roots that we have still in English for these things. Pimenas is one that we use for um meaning
14:07
uh some of your your translations. I think my translation even says pastor. Um because again, we have to blame it on the Latin.
14:40
Now the reason why I hold those two together and the reason why I've thrown our kai in there is the rest of these have a slightly different conjunction in the Greek. Many of your translations will say some as. Um it's a short two
14:51
little two-letter little conjunction there that probably means as. It can sometimes be a conjunction that would be used as and but. But kai is really our more definite and. And it's different
15:02
from the preceding three. These ones all have between them. And now I'm not going to remember how to spell it. Where's my Greek help here?
15:14
Oh yeah. So it's just day. Don't know why I couldn't remember that. So he writes to them this basically. Oops, I should do it in the Greek
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they and then he says some poiselos. So it's different. Those two are pushed together which is generally speaking the interpretation that most go with. Your English translations may or may not differentiate that is the the ones that
15:47
I looked at did have a slight differentiation there for your benefit. So it's pastor teacher or pastor and teacher together in a way that is differentiated from apostles, prophets,
15:59
evangelists then pastor and teacher. Okay. So that's a unit together from the Greek. All right. So, I'm not going to talk
16:09
about what whether I do or don't hold to apostles, prophets, evangelists. That's not our point specifically this morning. Our our point this morning is there are a couple of different words that get used in the Greek and then get
16:22
translated into English without necessarily a clear line of why we're saying one versus the other. These are given um Paul describes these as given by Christ, gifts to the church to fill
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these offices. these offices. Um we hold this idea of shepherds and teachers as synonymous with elders. Okay? synonymous with the office we are
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describing here. Synonymous with the office of as steward or as overseer. And that's the thing is Paul wasn't all that worried about being
16:58
clinical with his language when he does this. Okay. So he uses at minimum these four terms of presbuterat or five even oonomoman episcopas poas e dascalos
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meaning the various terms are applying to one role in the church. Okay. Is there any particular question or dispute
17:22
that that's what's happening in these various passages that he's describing an office of the church which is what we think of when we say a pastor or
17:33
an elder. Yeah. Bible probably during a class here.
18:06
So, it's I don't know that I can agree with always, but often. I can say often. Um, in my in my recollection that it's usually shephering. usually shephering. I'm fairly certain that this is not in
18:28
Okay. Okay. That's where that's coming from. Okay.
18:39
Right. Okay. Thank you. I hadn't checked all of that out, but So, okay. So, thank you. So this is the only place where as a noun it is used um of the office rather than as a verb related to the office.
18:50
Thank you. So yeah that that idea that um you know you can use presbuteras or elder as title overseer as what they're doing and shephering as the method I
19:01
like that. Um I think that's helpful. Um so we do though we say this word and we have been saying it here in in Titus this idea that that the elder is what
19:13
we're calling the office of overseeing okay and so the question has come up basically well why do we say
19:23
elder when there is some I mean in particular the question was raised last week uh I think it was that that a
19:34
lot of the things here or even the idea of being mature in the word, mature in your community, having a wisdom to share with the body could qualify you in the
19:45
other sense of elder, right? In the sense of being a benefit to the body, a member of the community who is able to um to guide or to help those younger
19:56
than you. And in fact um you can recall to yourself the various passages particularly in Timothy where he says um older men teach the younger men older
20:06
women teach the younger women the elder women there is literally just the feminine form of elder presbuteros. Okay. So it's used in that sense that is
20:17
a valid aspect of the body that those who are of more spiritual maturity and those who have had more time living in the word and and living according to the
20:28
principles of God should be instructing those who are noviceses. In fact, we're told elsewhere that the elder or the overseer should not be a novice. Okay.
20:39
So yes, but I am going to go and pivot here unless there's another question. So I guess I'll I'll finish this question. Um we use the term elder because that's the one I see most often that also seems
20:52
to encapsulate the idea of all of those things that the elder as office is a pinnacle. That's what he's showing us here in Titus and also in Timothy a pinnacle of those traits that ought yes
21:03
to be among the body as a whole but the elder is is to be above reproach in that way. Abigail.
21:30
So, what I will say, the the elders here have chosen to take on the word elder as the title. I'm not sure any of them would necessarily be upset if you said overseer. Um,
21:42
overseer. Um, these words are used in a non-clinical way in the scriptures. We have a tendency to want to nail them down and say it has to be this. Pastor as shepherd, I think, is also valid. The
21:54
reason we tend not to say that is because that's loaded with a lot of cultural baggage in our context. We we often think of pastor as soul,
22:04
the pastor of the church, the pastor rather than pastoring in that active sense together. So that's why I think the elders have typically not used that.
22:14
You had your hand up. Just that all words tend to pick up baggage as they move through time. Elder one of the least offensive except that
22:26
is a term that yeah nobody calls anybody an overseer bishop has a lot of baggage
22:55
So I think it's settling on a word that maybe carries the least amount of baggage. But none of these words are in themselves precise. They represent things also
23:09
but not in a responsible. Yeah. Um Dad, I saw your hand then come back to Justin.
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them first servants by God. And in that culture, a steward could have been a slave. And most of them
23:46
probably were slaves that were elevated to this position, but they were they were approved by the the householder by
23:57
the man of the house uh to do that job. And it's kind of interesting when I read Titus, you have the title,
24:09
the elder who oversees just like Peter, but he's reminding them you're God's man by God's grace, you've been put in this
24:21
position in charge, and your allegiance is to God. Yeah. um as his man. So
24:32
yeah, no, that that's a very valid point. Um and and you know, we we find the the word sometimes it gets translated in your English translations as bond servant, literally slave. Okay.
24:43
Slave to Christ. And and just as in the case of Joseph was still a slave and yet was raised to that position of having that, it does not remove or negate the
24:53
other aspects of being a Christian to be an elder. If anything, it is in some weird way a heightening of those things, but it is it also does not remove
25:03
membership of the body. Okay? So, we don't hold that the way that the Presbyterian polity does where the elders are actually answerable to their presetry,
25:15
not to the body. We are members of the body. Okay? The elders are members of given a certain role just as all members of the body have ministerial roles.
26:15
Yeah. No, I can agree with you wholeheartedly there and and that's part of why I say these these words are not and I think Chuck said, you know, they're not precise because there is some overlap. They're also not clinical definitions
26:25
that way. We're there is there is actually maybe a lesson in the sense that there is not one definite clinical term for the person who is leading the body actually because
26:37
Paul doesn't care to have it defined that way. What it is defined by is the things that he's speaking of here in Titus. It's defined by the things that he gives in first and second Timothy. It's defined even by some of the things
26:48
that we have in in uh Corinthians and and Ephesians and other places. So if you want to say various words that is also okay.
26:59
also okay. I think it's important to understand that every church has their way of doing
27:24
on how best I can I can ascent to the idea that yes the the polity is flexible because various churches have various makeups various needs there's no set number of elders there's no set number of deacons
27:34
there's no like those things will be flexible based on the membership that is that is very true and I do not condemn any church necessarily for using the the word uh pastor or using the word bishop
27:44
even um you know apostles I might side value quite a bit but we'll come back to that at another point. Uh did you have your hand up? I was saying that
28:47
I agree with that also which is you know the the the way the manner even to some extent the words you use do impact the psychology of the way that you deal with things. I feel like Mike Wazowski every time I hold this up with the sticker on the front um
28:59
says biblical eldership but you wouldn't know that. Um there's several of these back in the library. I recommend it not because it's gospel but because he's actually fairly thorough in his examination of these things and he does
29:10
touch a little bit actually on the idea of flexibility versus so he he highlights a number of places where he's encountered frankly terrible polity in some of the things it's done but also has a number of sections where he talks
29:22
about what he sees biblically in terms of the extent of flexibility within what is biblical and I think that's what we're narrowing in on is biblically there is room for it to be
29:35
shaped according to the need of that congregation. There are limits to that as you're pointing out. There are limits to that and it and it has to reflect first and foremost what is biblical there. Um, I saw Nick's hand first and
30:04
there are and I I would caution you in terms of looking at the Old Testament use of elder because it's not exactly the same uh as this because the Old Testament had a priesthood. Okay? and the Old Testament had other
30:15
prescriptions for how they were to interact as a whole and how they were to interact in their approach to God. Whereas we are told we're a royal priesthood. We we've talked a little bit
30:25
about this that there is no sense in which the elder becomes a cleric who is going to God on your behalf. That's not what we're doing. Okay, that's that's not it.
30:36
not it. Neither were their neither well that's where I'm coming to. So basic So basic the priesthood in that sense were in intended to be those who were allowed to enter and to put the things on the altar
30:48
and do those specific functions. The elders were more of a of a almost democratic function within them. Not truly democratic but the the idea of the elders representing groups of people
31:00
below them. Right? So there would be elders, a number of elders in each town or village and at times the elders would be called together in various ways to make decisions and you would have elders
31:11
from multiple towns in certain passages that that have gathered together. And even the non-Christian use of elders in the New Testament in a couple of places seems to be referring to that
31:21
semi-governmental structure. There's a couple of places in Acts where that comes up. Um, and I say non-Christian because the Jews had a tradition that stretches back. It's actually pre-Moses.
31:33
Some people point to Moses's um, advice from Jethro, sorry, Jethro's advice to Moses. I'll put it that way around to um, appoint men over various groups so that he's not having to judge
31:44
everybody and sit there all day long. I don't remember the specific numbers. It's something like hundreds and 50s and tens. Um so that that there's a sort of structuring there where there's levels of authority
31:56
of authority there is actually reference before that in Exodus where when God from the burning bush speaks to Moses he says go to the elders of Israel in Egypt and tell them I have heard
32:09
their cries. Right? So there is a there is an organic arising of the elders as effectively a a
32:19
governmental structure amongst the people not dissimilar to what you can see anthropologically in many societies um that elders and and the more mature members of the society have that role.
32:31
So I do distinguish the Christian New Testament use of elder. There are lessons you can draw from the Old Testament elders, but they're not really the same. It's it's that's I would be
32:42
careful like just doing a word study and looking up everywhere you find the word elder. It's gonna you're going to go in some strange directions doing that. Um Dad, I think I saw your hand up also.
32:54
Um, in my study in Peter, there are several commentators that that are they bring up the idea
33:04
that Peter doesn't he just kind of puts elders out there without building the structure of the church,
33:15
the structure of the church. And I've been trying to understand what do they mean by
33:27
church. What they rest on is that well this was a young church. They were displaced. They had come to Asia Minor maybe because of persecution or whatever and
33:38
that he was trying to establish these new churches. But when I again going back to Titus that the steward does not report to a bishop who reports to aer
33:53
Correct. And so I'm thinking, what else do you need? This is this is this is the what we've been given been given from Acts from Peter that the elders are
34:08
among the flock and yet they are appointed to be the overseers as God's stewards. What else do you need?
34:19
Yeah. No, that that's exactly right. Um and and actually Stra points out in his book somewhere I think near the end um he says not only does the biblical body
34:30
need no more structure than elders and deacons, it should want or accept no more structure than that. That is one of the the things that I've tried to point out here is that the the biblical
34:42
structure of the church is relatively flat. Okay, we're not building this ladder of hierarchy up to a pope where there's like eight or 12 layers of
34:53
different people who have to report up the chain. That's not it. It is meant to be a body, a family where the elders are again members of the body who have been given a particular role just as the
35:04
deacons are members of the body who have a particular role. And I do at some point want to talk about the idea that all the members of the church have a role to play in ministry. That's what he says there in Ephesians is the role of
35:15
the elder is to equip everyone to do the work of the ministry. Lauren
35:49
that's a very very valid point. Um, yes. So, I I think it is a point well made that that the structure is both the biblical structure and has its its role to play. That's why God gave it to us
36:00
that that people should be integrated in this way. Um and and actually the more structure that you pile on the further people can get from the work that they're supposed to be doing in that
36:10
way. I mean again look at at Ephesians 4 there. He's talking about that ENA context of the body made up of its members, right? He's not saying um you
36:21
know we don't have a giraffe neck of offices to go up before you get up to Christ who is the head. It is the body given in that picture. There are members and the head is there. Okay. So that's
36:33
that is the the picture made uh uh that Paul gives of of a functioning body, a body walking according to those principles. So all of this to say I did
36:44
I think maybe glance over this quickly the first time around thinking that there was maybe more familiar with the various terms than maybe there was. So hopefully that helps you understand the
36:55
levels or the the terms and the fact that we don't hold on to them clinically. We prefer the term elder one because as as Nick has pointed out, it's the most common term, but also it just
37:06
it seems to us maybe the most at least loaded of the terms that we can use there. again, steward, overseer, shepherd, teacher, all of those are are
37:17
aspects of that ministry that we're going to talk a little bit more next week. But we're out of time for this morning. So, we'll close in a word of prayer as we uh prepare to go upstairs to worship.
37:34
Father, we do thank you for the word that you have given. We thank you for giving us this structure. We thank you for the reminder from your word that indeed we are a royal priesthood. We have no king or priest ahead of us other
37:46
than Jesus Christ, the forerunner, the one who went before us to make a way through the veil. that we have direct access in this way to you to call upon
37:56
your name to be assured that our prayers are heard that you see and recognize and accept us in even though we are dust and
38:08
unacceptable. He has made us clean that we can enter the throne room and speak to you. Father, I ask that you would be with us this morning that the spirit would be active among us and that you would be glorified in our worship. I ask in Jesus
